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LHC - Large Hadron Collider

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    Posted: 29.May.2011 at 11:27
Large Hadron Collider (Veliki hadronski trkalnik)



Nekaj osnovnih podatkov: (vir: Wikipedija)

"
Veliki hadronski trkalnik (angleško Large Hadron Collider, okrajšano LHC) je kompleks pospeševalnika električno nabitih osnovnih delcev, namenjen za trkanje nasprotnih tokov (žarkov) protonov z zelo veliko kinetično energijo. Glavni cilj je raziskovanje veljavnosti in omejitev standardnega modela, trenutno veljavne teoretične slike v fiziki osnovnih delcev. Predvidevajo, da bo trkalnik potrdil obstoj Higgsovih bozonov, kar bo lahko potrdilo napovedi in manjkajoče vezi v standardnem modelu, ter pojasnilo kako osnovni delci pridobivajo značilnosti, kot je na primer njihova masa.

Veliki hadronski trkalnik je zgradila Evropska organizacija za jedrske raziskave (CERN) in leži ob francosko-švicarski meji pri Ženevi. Projekt vzdržuje in pripravlja več kot osem tisoč fizikov iz več kot petinosemdeset držav ter nekaj sto univerz in laboratorijev. Stroški celotnega projekta so ocenjeni na 3,2 do 6,4 milijard €.[1]

Trkalnik deluje in je trenutno v fazi priprave na trke. Prve žarke so skozi trkalnik spustili 10. septembra 2008, prve visokoenergijske trke pa so predvideli za 21. oktober, ko ga bodo uradno odprli.

Izgradnja

Trkalnik je trenutno največji pospeševalnik. Prav tako je zmožen doseči največje energije.[2][1] Leži v krožnem tunelu z obsegom 27 km, 50 do 175 m pod zemljo. 3,8 m širok betonski tunel, ki so ga zgradili med letoma 1983 in 1988, so prej uporabljali za Veliki elektronski-pozitronski trkalnik (LEP).[3] Na štirih mestih prečka mejo med Švico in Francijo, večji del pa leži v Franciji. V zgradbah na površju je pomožna oprema, kot so kompresorji, prezračevalna oprema, nadzorna elektronika in hladilna oprema.

Tunel trkalnika je sestavljen iz dveh med seboj vzporednih žarkovnih cevi, ki se sekata na štirih mestih. Vsaka vsebuje protonski žarek, ki potuje v nasprotnih smereh okrog obroča. 1232 dipolnih magnetov skrbi, da je krožna pot žarkov pravilna, 392 dodatnih kvadrupolnih magnetov pa skrbi za fokusiranje žarkov, da so možnosti interakcije med delci na štirih mestih, kjer se žarka sekata, karseda velike. Vsega skupaj je nameščenih 1600 superprevodnih magnetov z maso 27 ton. Za ohranjanje operativne temperature magnetov 1,9 K je potrebno približno 96 ton kapljevinskega helija. Zaradi tega je Trkalnik največja kriogenska naprava pri temperaturi kapljevinskega helija na svetu.
"

Kakšen je pa metalski podled na to temo?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pestilence. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29.May.2011 at 11:54
Večina nas tukaj si ni sposobna ustvarit mnenja o taki zadevi. Iz inženirskega stališča je cel kompleks zelo impresiven. O dogajanju tam pa znanje večine ljudi bazira na nekaj internetnih člankih, kar je vredno popolnoma nič.

Tako da, večina članov foruma nima podlage da bi lahko izrazili mnenje o tem^^


Cool factor pa:
Z-Machine > LHC

Z-machine
Inertial fusion



Edited by pestilence. - 29.May.2011 at 12:01
"En dan se mi bo strgal vse bom pustu in bom šu." Janez Zmazek-Žan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Biomorph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29.May.2011 at 12:35
Krajše ne gre.

CERN in 3 Minutes (2009)


Meni je to zelo, če ne ultimativno zanimivo. Zelim si, da bi imel več časa.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brutalc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29.May.2011 at 14:01
Eh, cern je za amaterje, naravno je boljše

Cosmic rays with even higher energies have since been observed. Among them was the Oh-My-God particle observed on the evening of 15 October 1991.
The energy of this particle is some 40 million times that of the highest energy protons that can currently be produced in any particle accelerator.
Oh my god particle

Pestilence, se strinjam s tabo, Z-machine je res bol kul :) Prav tako se strinjam, da si večina ljudi lahko predstavlja samo osnove celotnega projekta, kaj vse delajo tam pa je preveč.

Še ena kul stvar:
Joint European Torus (trenutno največji fuzijski reaktor)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 01:07
Yo Madafakaz! :)

http://www.technewsworld.com/rsstory/73351.html?wlc=1316819111

a kdo že kaj ve o tem in ali bi se komu dalo kaj pokomentirat na bolj
normalen ljudski način.

Baje, da nej bi na dan pršle ugotovitve, da naj bi se Neutrini gibali hitreje od svetlobe.
Baje je cela panika in ful folka zdaj čekira izračune, v upanju, da se ne bo kmalu pol fizike postavlo na glavo. Big%20smile

Če na subatomskem nivoju potujejo delci hitreje od svetlobe - ali to pomeni, da potujejo nazaj skozi čas? Big%20smile 


Blinded by the Light?

Scientists are questioning the results of the Opera experiment.

For example, astrophycist Dave Goldberg, author of A User's Guide to the Universe, contended the result is flawed and posted a calculation on his blog.

The problem is that Opera's findings might overturn Albert Einstein's theory of special relativity, which states that there's an ultimate speed limit, equal to about 300,000 km per second (186,000 mph).

Light particles travel at this speed in a vacuum because they have no mass, but neutrinos have mass, and those produced in high-energy collisions at CERN should travel "at about 99.9998 percent of the speed of light," stated Joseph Lykken, a scientist at the Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory.

Special relativity is only meant to hold when space-time is flat. Realizing this, Einstein developed his general theory of relativity to explain the physics of curved space, Lykken told TechNewsWorld.

"We have good evidence that space-time is quite flat near the Earth, so a violation of special relativity could mean that the curvature of space is somehow hidden -- perhaps it occurs in extra dimensions of space," Lykken remarked.

Another possibility is that special relativity doesn't exactly apply to neutrinos, Lykken suggested.

This "would cause a crisis in quantum theory since our understanding of elementary particles relies on a very delicate dance between quantum behavior and special relativity," Lykken elaborated.

So, time travel might be a possibility, or there might be pocket dimensions in space, and the pas de deux between quantum science and special relativity might turn into a tango. No wonder scientists are excited.


Edited by Wind Carrier - 24.Sep.2011 at 01:10
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jure_aeonic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 02:10
Sej delci gredo lahko hitreje od svetlobe, samo ne v vakuumu, kokr je men to jasno. Primer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherenkov_radiation

Predpostavljen je, da nevtrino ma maso, to pa pomen, da svetlobne hitrosti v vakuumu ne more presežt. Če pa jo vseeno lahko(s tem, da ma vseeno maso), potem pa se da potovat v času nazaj.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brutalc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 09:56
Če ima maso prideš do tega problema, da po lorentzovi transformaciji potrebuje delec z maso ob svetlobni hitrosti neskončno energijo. (E = mc^2 γ)(v->c, γ->1/0, E-> ∞)
Stvar je ta, da je v shranjevalnem obroču vseh pospeševalnikov vakum in so zato očitno izmerili hitrost tam, torej gre hitreje od svetlobe?
Če pa v cernu ne poznajo zavornega sevanja(cherenkov efekt) bi to bil največji fail v zgodovini :D
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote devlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 10:39
Vakuum je ta moment tudi v moji glavi. I bow to the awesomeness of the physics Shocked
The Optimistic Cynic: Remaining completely oblivious to the tragedy of existence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brutalc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 11:13
The thing is you've seen nothing yet
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote devlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 11:44
Big%20smile
The Optimistic Cynic: Remaining completely oblivious to the tragedy of existence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rožica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24.Sep.2011 at 16:47
V CERNu se bo zdaj začelo (oz. nadaljevalo) zelo zelo fejst preverjanje časa 60 nanosekund +-14 nanosekund, za katerega so nevtrini prehiteli fotone na 730 kilometrski (+-20cm) progi.

Nobene panike ni, ker itak se resnica išče. :]
tule je kul člančič o situaciji, iz katerega je tudi link na osnutek poročila o eksperimentu. Klik klok. Priporočam že zaradi tega, ker si mogoče ne predstavljate ravno, kako netrivialen posel je uskladiti dve uri tako daleč narazen, da se lahko merijo razlike časov na milijardinke sekund natančno.

brutalc, hitrosti niso merili v pospeševalniku ampak s prehajanjem čez zemeljsko skorjo.

Fizika se ne bo sesula kar tako, razen če vsa mašinerija ter svet okoli nas funkcionira ker božanstva tako želijo.


Edited by rožica - 24.Sep.2011 at 16:47
All matter in the universe is destined to become the scrap heap of history.

It’s called the 2nd Law.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26.Sep.2011 at 09:18
Originally posted by devlin devlin wrote:

Vakuum je ta moment tudi v moji glavi. I bow to the awesomeness of the physics Shocked


praise the lord!


Edited by Wind Carrier - 26.Sep.2011 at 09:41
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote devlin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26.Sep.2011 at 18:37
I would,  if there was one.

Edited by devlin - 26.Sep.2011 at 18:38
The Optimistic Cynic: Remaining completely oblivious to the tragedy of existence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27.Sep.2011 at 01:44
you just did a little while ago  - you worshiped the "lord of the moment" accepted by the masses - science. 

(moj prejšni post je bil metafora)


Edited by Wind Carrier - 27.Sep.2011 at 13:06
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jan Ov Plain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27.Sep.2011 at 10:45
Znanost NI vera, jao. Stvarnost je stvarnost. Znanost odseva stvarnost.



Sicer je pa rožica lepo napisal, 'nobene panike ni, ker itak se resnica išče'.
Occam's razor can leave a scar, but it can remove the cancer so often caused by the poison of liars and imaginers.

Ignorant men raise questions that wise men answered a thousand years ago.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27.Sep.2011 at 13:04


za vse vernike :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Feyerabend

upam, da ne bom gorel na grmadi Shocked LOL




Edited by Wind Carrier - 27.Sep.2011 at 13:24
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rožica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27.Sep.2011 at 13:29
Originally posted by Wind Carrier Wind Carrier wrote:



za vse vernike :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Feyerabend

upam, da ne bom gorel na grmadi Shocked LOL



Gorel na grmadi? Waste of good matches, bi rekel Blackadder.LOL
Kako si razlagaš tale njegov citat iz konca tega članka, ki si ga nalepil?
  • ...And it is of course not true that we have to follow the truth. Human life is guided by many ideas. Truth is one of them. Freedom and mental independence are others. If Truth, as conceived by some ideologists, conflicts with freedom, then we have a choice. We may abandon freedom. But we may also abandon Truth.

Sicer pa nisem še nikoli čul, da bi filozofija znanosti bila nepriznana stvar. Upam da se bom kdaj spomnil kako njegovo knjigo vzet v roke ...



Edited by rožica - 27.Sep.2011 at 13:35
All matter in the universe is destined to become the scrap heap of history.

It’s called the 2nd Law.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Biomorph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16.Mar.2012 at 06:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rožica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16.Mar.2012 at 09:27
Sicer se še čaka na zadostno količino novih podatkov, ampak:

Zakaj nevtrini najverjetneje niso bili hitrejši od svetlobe

Edited by rožica - 16.Mar.2012 at 09:29
All matter in the universe is destined to become the scrap heap of history.

It’s called the 2nd Law.
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